This website is a testimony to the problems Canadian Student Loan borrowers experienced from approximately 1996 to 2008 and until their loans were paid off.

The privatization of the Student Loans system by the Chretien and Martin Liberal governments broke the system and defaulted thousands of borrowers who were trying to pay their loans. There were even stories of suicide due to the harassment of borrowers.

Read the report that I prepared back in 2007 here. Canada Student Loans-The Need for Change Fortunately the new Conservative government at the time revamped the program and fixed the system for new borrowers, but borrowers under the previous program were left with ruined credit and continued harassment from debt collectors.

I call on the Canadian Government to apologize to the borrowers affected by this fiasco and make amends.

Unfortunately the Liberal government is again clobbering the Education system with their upcoming changes to International Student Visas. Yes, there's a problem, but instead of a well thought out plan, they have pulled the emergency brake on the train causing a derailment. This has introduced unprecedented instability for both private and public education institutions who serve both international and local students.

Universities can't plan. I've heard of courses being cut because the government has no process in place for universities to send the newly required acceptance letters to the government.

This means that students who have been accepted can not attend courses that start in the summer 2024 semester. With cut sections, current Canadian students will have trouble getting courses, and may have to switch to part-time which changes their enrollment status and might trigger repayment of their loans or ineligibility for funding. I've seen this before. It wreaks havoc on the student loan borrowers.

Again, the Liberal government has messed up the education environment. Will the new system needed in a rush for the acceptance letters be the new Arrivecan scandal?

I call on the government to implement a slower phased in approach and delay the requirement of the acceptance letters until a process is in place to submit these letters.


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    Posted: 09/November/2005 at 7:36pm

Man, do I wish I had found this forum years ago!  Or at least A year ago.  I might be sorted by now.

Sorry, this is bound to be long.  I've been living with it alone for so long that it could take me a bit to get my thoughts organized.

I was first diagnosed with chronic fatigue syndrome around 1994, during my last year of university.  Being at the time a single parent, fairly desperate, with a family/support system that had often dismissed that exact condition (then known as 'yuppie flu') as sheer malingering, I knew I couldn't 'afford' that diagnosis without losing all family support in a battle I just couldn't face at the time.  So my obliging internist told me to tell people I had 'reactive hypoglycemia' that made me very tired at intervals, careful about diet, etc. 

Naturally, I didn't get any documentation of that diagnosis then.  I didn't want to believe it, and I couldn't face that I had something lifelong that might prevent me from ever earning a living, much less repaying that pile of debt.  So I kept scrambling through part-time jobs, using up my interest relief, even going back to school for one semester in late 1996 to keep the interest relief (BAD mistake!).  If I had known about the 'disabled students' benefits then, I might have been more open to it.  Hindsight...

By 1999, I was in debt up to my eyeballs on credit cards & lines of credit (why they'd even give me them????), unable to work hardly at all, even took a summer on EI illness benefits to 'rest up'.  The next summer I declared failure at life, moved in with a relative in the hopes that a winter of freedom from money stress (except the PSL, which I was making payments on by then - I got that reduced for the year due to hardship) would see me healthy again.

It didn't work.  In summer 2001, the diagnosis of cfs was confirmed.  I finally accepted I wouldn't ever get to really use my two degrees and declared bankrupty.  They told me I'd have to wait out the remainder of the 10 years on the SL, but that all I had to do was be polite to the collection agents when they called and explain to them that I was disabled.   No mention of not acknowledging debt or statute-barred or anything of that nature (I'm still not sure how that works).

A relative gave me a little job I could do at home (bookkeeping), supplied me with a computer and internet connection, paid me enough of a wage that I could pay room & board to my host-relative, and paid my AB Health and Blue Cross (less a 'waiver' for my pre-existing disability).  It was only supposed to be while I waited for my CPP disability pension application to be processed.  CPP turned me down because I was 'able to work a bit', never mind that I was only able to work about 10 hours a week, in my own home, free from stress, CO2, cleaning chemicals, perfumes, carpeting, smoke, and so on....and was barely making enough to pay for my groceries.  So I was stuck. 

I could have gone to the province for disability benefits then, but it was only a couple of hundred more than I was making and would have involved a lot more doctoring and form filling and oversight etc without adding anything much to my quality of life (and the stress of the CPP application had pretty much destroyed me).  So the relatives (host and employer) decided they could support me a little longer in the current circs, and that's how things are today - I do a bit of bookkeeping and a bit of housekeeping (on good days), and haven't a lick of savings or assets and only a penny's worth of hope (on good days).

That 'I'm disabled' explanation worked for a couple of years - one explanation to each CA and then no calls - then about 18 months ago they started calling again, and the NCO guy told me I could apply for a federal forgiveness on grounds of disability.

(yes, a CA told me that!  He also sent me the forms and basically held my hand through getting up-to-date medical documentation in order.  Then he faxed everything to Ottawa for me.  Judging by this new hassle, though, he doesn't work there any more  )

So - the application went to Ottawa over a year ago.  In late January I got a letter from SocDev Canada asking for my tax returns.  I sent them back and a couple of months later got a phone message asking me to call a guy there.  I tried, but the automated phone system ate my calls and I never heard back. 

By then, Federal Credit was on me for the provincial loans.  The girl there was very nice once she heard I was disabled (it wasn't in the file they had), and said she could start the application for provincial forgiveness but it wasn't likely to succeed unless the federal one did.  So we agreed to wait for a response to that, and either she phoned me or I phoned her once a month just to verify that I hadn't moved.  Last summer, after a winter of waiting, she suggested we go ahead with the application, just to break the monotony.  I wrote a letter outlining the status of the federal application as I then knew it, sent her copies of the medical documentation, and haven't heard another word (yet - touch wood!).

Then I lost the file in which I kept all my medical documents & correspondence.  It probably got mixed up in a stack of bookkeeping, but although we searched through every file I had touched for the past 3 months, it never turned up.  Now I had NO information to even write a letter to SocDev or seek an alternate phone number.  I wasn't too worried as I figured they'd have to write to me again sooner or later (another BAD mistake!)

MEANWHILE... as some of you probably know, the Social Development branch of HRDC turned over to CRA.  And someone looked at my file, saw the apparently unanswered phone call from last spring, checked a box somewhere marked 'did not respond' and sent it back to NCO.

They called me again.  I responded politely, with the circs.  The woman gave me a couple of weeks to try to track down whoever in the government NOW had my file and try to get them to reconsider that obnoxious checkmark.  Despite scouring the CRA website, trying every (public) phone number (all busy, all the time, and not even in tax season) and tying up a government reference operator for hours trying to find a department that had anything to do with student loans that were already in default (you'd think it wouldn't be THAT hard), I couldn't find anybody to even point me in the right direction within the government.

I emailed my MP asking for help tracking down the right government department (I said right at the top - not asking for intervention, only for information!).  Lovely looking man, very Conservative, lots of oil-rich friends.... he hasn't responded.

I broke down in tears on the phone with the NCO woman, and she agreed to help me by faxing in a new letter to Ottawa (said all she had was a fax number).  So I wrote a new letter, updating the one from last year with all the gory detail of how much worse my health is, went to the dr and got copies of the basic medical documentation from 2001 and 2004, sent them up to her and assumed she had faxed them off.

That was nearly 6 weeks ago.  With no contact, I assumed everything was under control until today, when a DIFFERENT CA from NCO phoned me and gave me the whole works - denied there was anything in my file about disability, asked about my children's earning potential, said he was raised to honour his parents and he'd help them out if they were in my shoes, wanted to know if my family members would give me money so I could make even small payments... the whole gamut that I now recognize from reading here, but had never heard from any of the other CAs in the past 4 years.

He finally got me so upset that I shouted,  "I have no money, no assets, no car, no credit rating to threaten.  The only thing keeping me alive is that I don't want to screw up my children by suiciding while they're just getting their feet under them as adults."  Then he backed off a bit, said I should call him back 'when I was calm enough to discuss this'.

Before anybody asks (although I'm hoping somebody reads this far, at least), I'm sure he didn't break the law or step over the line into harassment, just was so persistent and wouldn't go look at the file where all the medical information was ("it would take a whole day to get the hard copy sent up here") and kept dragging me back to things that I had covered in the letters I sent and that I hate to discuss or even look at all at once, because they're so bloody depressing that if I had any sense I WOULD end it all

(don't worry; I'm not going to - the only thing I use my psych degree for these days is recognizing and treating my periodic crushing depressions - can't see another counsellor as I can't leave home without a driver and anyway the Blue Cross waiver won't pay for one - just another really sucky wrinkle in my life right now)

...

...

...

So, finally, I do have some questions.

1.  Is it true what the bankruptcy trustee said all those years ago, that hanging up or not answering or being rude to CA's could be held against me when I apply for discharge of my student loans (either after December 2006 or as soon as Bill C-55 passes - assuming an election doesn't get in the way again)?

2.  If I really *should* continue to take his calls and be polite, what is the minimum response I can make that won't either mess up my discharge on grounds of non-cooperation or set me up for a repeat of the emotional wringer and subsequent health impacts that I've had today?

3.  Does anyone know who I can call/write/email at CRA to even find out if they got the last letter explaining that I had tried many times to call them back and got no response, and asking them to review the application again?

4.  Should my relative just fire me, so I don't have ANY income to tempt them?  Would it strengthen my disability application to be completely unemployable (it already says, in my dr's handwriting, that the condition is permanent and I'm working as much as I'm capable of)?

Thanks just for giving me a place to put all this down in writing - I feel like I have a chance now, instead of walking around like that cartoon character with the black cloud over him all the time.

Hair-tearer in Alberta

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momof2 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote momof2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25/November/2005 at 6:38am

hear tearer

man it sounds like you need a break.  i can relate - i have cfs as well, among other things ( bi polar manic depressive, obsessive compulsive, fibromyalgia and carpal tunnel to boot plus a splash of seasonal affective disorder to make it interesting).  oh yeah and i have anger management problems accorking to my husband - i have a short fuse for some reason, i'm getting it checked out...  my engineering diplomas look really nice on the wall, too bad i can't use em for anything.

got tired of the run around - my app went missing and my file was sent to collections.  i'm tired of fighting at this point - i say let em sue me.  the phone doesnt ring anymore- my hubby got the number changed and unlisted and my loans are in my maiden name so at least i can sleep a few hours a night now.

i'm thinking if you were totally unemployed your chances of qualifying for disability benefits would be better.  i'm no expert though. johnny may have an idea who to talk to about your app status.

hang in there, hope things will get better soon

professionals built the titanic but amateurs built the ark...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hairtearer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/November/2005 at 2:29pm

Thanks for the words of support, momof2.

Having a short fuse is a normal reaction to all the stress we're under - physical and otherwise.  I found that eating a hypoglycemic diet (every 2-3 hours, including protein in every 'snack') made a big difference in my fuse length.

I haven't heard anything back from that last doofus yet (touch wood!) but I have decided what to say if I accidentally pick up the phone to a CA between now and next June (when Bill C-55 will come into effect and I can apply for the bankruptcy roll-in, or whatever it's called):  "I'm sorry but I can't help you.  I have been advised to take no action about this issue until either the loan forgiveness comes through or Bill C-55 comes into effect."

Since I have no assets, and almost never any $$ in my bank account, and my first-born child is out of the country, it's hard to see what else they can do to me besides say nasty things to me on the phone.  My 'employer' knows the score and will fire me before he obeys a garnishment order.  We've been discussing whether he should fire me anyway, to help with the disability issue.  I guess it will depend on how much more hassle the CAs decide to lay on me in the next 7 months.

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