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SolveStudentDebt 
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 Posted: 11/September/2008 at 10:37am |
YOu should call the Supie of BAnkruptcy in Ottawa and find out for sure if it is in effect.
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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Angela
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Posted: 15/September/2008 at 4:13pm |
ok... so this is a good one for all of you. Get a drink and sit down. This is a long one... I could shorten it, but it wouldn't make for as good a reading...
First the whole university/college thing was a joke. I went to a counsellor within the "Hallowed Walls Of University" to find out how to become a teacher. She talked me into taking an agriculture diploma instead... how? Don't ask. I was naive. I do not wish to remember that fault of my character...  But, I have since found out the university/college was going to lose the agriculture program if they didn't get more people to sign up for it...
So, this was in May of 1995. In June of 1995 I participated in a "getting to know the student loans program and how to apply for one" session. The financial advisor told us at that time that a Student Loan will NEVER affect a persons Credit. Yeah I know. ROFLMCLAO. What can I say??? Naive... 
So, I went to the credit union and gave them my completed form, as at that time you had to request a student loan from your financial institution. They, of course agreed.
Ok... so sometime in the fall of 1995 the student loan policies were changed. I... being naive... didn't realize this and kept on happily applying for student loan continuation as I was still taking courses. (this comes into play later) I completed 5 years of University/college in three years... because back then you could do that... as long as you were willing to take an average of 14 courses per semester. I was and I did. And I maintained an average GPA of 4.0... 
Then hardship fell. Twas the student loan program that caused it too... they decided to audit me. They sent me this info in June of 1997 and asked for some forms to be sent back. I got the forms together, and mailed them. In early august I called them to find out how things were going as I started school in september... They had "not received" the forms that I had sent. So I got their fax number. I gathered up the forms again and faxed them. I waited a week before I called them. They did "not receive" them either. Ok. I took a deep breath and went to a gov't office. Asked them to fax them for me. They did. I waited a week... I am now in september and have had to borrow my tuition from my mother... I called them. They still have "not received" my forms. GRRRRRRRR.... So, I again faxed them from my mps office. I waited a week... guess what??? they received them. But it will take at least 6 weeks to finalize the process.... To make a long story short... they finalized the process a week into the january semester. I couldn't pay for my courses when I needed to, so I was unable to finish my last semester... Consequently... I can not make the money that I should be making because I did not get my two dips and one cert. Which was THEIR fault, not mine.
So, a few years later, 2003, I wanted student loans off my back. I was disabled and could not pay my student loans, and couldn't before I became disabled because I was not making the money I should have been making if I had been able to finish University/College as scheduled... So, I went to a local bankruptcy company... I won't tell you who it was as they are well known as your local bankruptcy company...
The bankruptcy trustee listened to my issues. I was behind $5000 in debt, not including my student loans. The trustee told me that the best option I had, to get out from under this debt (student loans) was to declare bankruptcy, then wait my full 10 years after my last day of school and apply to have my student loans set aside. Not knowing any better... (there is that Naiveness again) I listened to her, and applied for bankruptcy. I had to pay it off at a reasonable $100/mth for 24 months. In 2005 I was discharched. So, I paid them $2400 to become bankrupt. This is now 2008. At $100/mth I would have paid off all my creditors... except student loans. I would have been in exactly the same situation as I am in now... except I wouldn't be bankrupt!
As a person who is bankrupt, the hardships really have only just begun. I can not get a mortgage... I can not get a bank loan... I can not even get a monthly plan on a silly cell phone! I can get a credit card... IF I send them $300-$1500 to secure the credit card and they will hold that security for me until I cancel my credit card. At which time they will pay back the $300-$1500 WITHOUT the interest that it would have accrued.
Now, as you know, in these times, EVERYONE and their dog needs a credit card. Just to rent a carpet shampooer from your local grocery store requires a credit card to hold against any damages incurred. So, I have to PAY for the privelage of getting a credit card with REALLY high interest rates.... which would put me right back in debt again.
So, is bankruptcy your only option??? or is it even an option??? with what I know now... a very resounding NO! But... that is my experience, and my experience only. Once you have declared bankruptcy, it will not get better! Just the creditors are off your back. That's all. It isn't a fresh start... or a new one. It just means you can answer your phone.
And for all of you who get calls from collection agencies??? They are mostly based on auto dialers. Just pick up the phone and hang up immediately. This will register as a wrong number with the auto dialler and the phone calls stop. I am not suggesting that you should not pay back your creditors... just telling you how to give yourself some time to make some payments...
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bridgyw34
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Joined: 17/September/2008
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Posted: 17/September/2008 at 8:15pm |
Ok so here's my story...short version anyway. By the way, I am so glad to find posts from folks who are in similar situations as mine. I finished my BA in 1998 (5 years, full loans). I was unable to find work to afford my loan payments so was faithfully applying to interest relief every 6 months (I had a child right after graduation, so wasn't really working much). So in 2001 I went back to community college for a Pharm Tech diploma and accrued even more student loan debt, but this time it was through the prov and fed gov'ts, not the banks. Anyway, I was still not making enough money to pay the loans, so I was back to interest free relief. Things were going well until my spouse at the time switched jobs right around renewal time. There was some discrepancy with his paystubs...long story short, the govt lenders said that he made too much that one month, refused the interest relief. The rough part was is that the most previous loans were quite small and I had no trouble making the monthly payments. It was the loans from my degree which were unaffordable...$40 000 with a $10/hr job. But because the student loan lenders had changed, if the prov and fed govt lenders refused my interest relief, they would not forward it to the banks where the big loans were and I was not permitted to bypass them and send it my self. Anyway, one by one my loans went into default, creditors phoning, all that jazz. I was working full time, had a 5 year old child and another due in a couple of months...It was all quite overwhelming. I finally contacted a trustee and I filed a consumer proposal in April 2005 which ends in April 2010 and pay $300/month. Now if I could get some input on the discharge possibilities with the new 7 year rule...the proposal was solely my student loans with a total debt of
$56 000. I am now a single parent with a take home income of approximately $2200 plus child support (not sure if it counts as income in this case). I know I am not in a hardship situation...I support my family fine, but there would be no way I could pay $40000 straight up in 2010 when the proposal ends. Anyway, any info would be helpful. Also anyone know exactly how this 5 year hardship rule would apply to my case?? Thanks  |
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Angela
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Posted: 18/September/2008 at 10:12am |
Ok. So I got the rundown of how to get your student loans out of your hair... BUT only if you have gone through bankruptcy. First, you have to have used all your debt reduction and interest relief options within the system. After you have done that, if you have already declared bankruptcy, then you can ask your trustee to apply to have your student loans, both provincial and federal, included in your bankruptcy. My trustee says that additional application to the court for this procedure does cost about another $500 at this time, or you can go through a lawyer who specializes in this stuff.
Am I right Johnny?
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Dance In The Sunshine
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 19/September/2008 at 3:13am |
I didn't know that the supie's office was a hair salon  The most difficult part of the application is the opposition that follows by the crown's appointed representative that is assigned to attend these hearings. Ads for costs, well ... be prepared. Any lawyer can argue on your behalf. It is not something that requires any specialized designation. It is all based on facts and points as to whether or not someone can or should continue to repay.
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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bridgyw34
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Posted: 19/September/2008 at 5:26am |
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Thanks for the replies...but I am still slightly confused. When I filed my consumer proposal it already included my student loans...actually that's all it included, I had no other debt. So do I need to file for bankruptcy as well once my proposal is finished in order to have my debt cleared? Over the five year period I will have paid $15000 towards the loans, not including the trustee fees on top of that. Would that count as me making a reasonable effort to pay my debt? This whole situation is very overwhelming and confusing. When I filed the proposal I was 9 months pregnant at the time and I wasn't thinking too clearly. That's why I am asking all these questions now. It seemed like a quick fix to the creditor harrassment at the time.
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Angela
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Posted: 20/September/2008 at 7:36am |
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Have you used up all your debt reduction? up to 26,000 over a 3 year period. And you can reapply to get interest free on your loans. You need to have used that up as well. After you have used both those up, you MAY be eligible for hardship, IF you qualify. The maximum amount you are allowed to earn should be able to put you in the right category, however this is something that Johnny should answer as he is far more qualified to answer as correctly as possible. Meaning... things change as fast as the tide, it seems.
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Dance In The Sunshine
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DBforgiveness
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Posted: 20/September/2008 at 5:22pm |
I also am considering a consumer Propsal however my main question is
Because my loan is prior to 1999 the bank holds my loan CSL...when I spoke with the bank they said that the government hand already paid out the loan...
The government web site says any loan made prior to 1999 is handled by the bank...
Does that mean any loss is fully covered by the bank and cannot be recovered (ie unpaid portion is then paid by the government, leaving me with a bill still to pay)
If this is the case bank-o makes sense...
Im going to call Ottawa for more info Thanks Johnny...
I spoke with a trustee that told me to come in to discuss bankruptcy...however I know they are trying to sell me a service...If I can aviod it that would be good...otherwise my financial situation is not going to change for a long time...thats only going to allow the interest to be compounded.
The NSLC has no debt on file just my name (ie. no $$$$ attached)
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DBforgiveness
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Posted: 20/September/2008 at 5:41pm |
I want to ask you before you applied for bankruptcy could you have applied for any of the things that you couldnt get while bankrupt (ie car, mortgage, etc)
Most likely not...re-establishing your credit after being discharged means following up with the Credit reporting agencieds to see that it is no longer listed because if it is then it will be hard for you...No Credit is a just as bad as Bad Credit....
They say in order for you to re establish your credit and for it to be list to the credit bureau you need at least 2 forms of credit...a secured card ( even though it is not gaining interest _ is a good start....in 6mon-12 months as long as the card is in good standing apply for another card with a low limit....if you have friend/family that caN HELP...APPLY AS A SECONDARY CARD HOLDER...I know very little about credit and Just want to learn more about bankruptcy/consumer propsal....Is it 7 years from the time you are discharged or is it once you filed bank-o is that when your time starts?
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 21/September/2008 at 4:40am |
Interest on student loans does not compound. If anyone has told you that it is untrue.
Let's take a perspective approach here ...
Establishing credit is not the issue. It is the establishment of relationships in the financial community that will get you where you need to be. Bankruptcy severely complicates this as you now carry a new identity, of which is characterized negatively by financial community.
How does securing a credit card get you your "credit back"? How does being a supplimentary cardholder on an account do the same? It does not work that way. I suppose someone in the bankruptcy and debt pooling industry has to tell you something, but that is very 18th century advice. Is having a secured credit card a relationship? IN a very small way, yes. However, it is VERY limited, and gives you no benefit "outside that box". Does "supplimentary cardholdership" build you a relationship? Sure, with the one who owns the account but not the financer or credit grantor of that product. You have to see through the lens that the financial community sees through. Then, you would be better equipped.
Here is one way to look at this - If you are bankrupt, then getting credit again really shouldn't be an issue. If you cannot see yourself contributing to your bad debt anytime in the future, how do you see yourself contributing to repaying new credit accounts? What you are sayng here is that you rely on credit to live (which is an unfortunate fact of life for an awful lot of people). Relying on credit to live is what the financial community promotes. That is the only way it can harness the consumer market and force it's loyalty. You are certainly not alone, DB.
For student loans, all you have to do is demonstrate your inablity (if you truly have no ability) and they can be set aside. Sometimes people recieve resistance by the recovery sectors when tryng to demonstrate this, but if that happens, there is help for those who need it.
If one cannot pay a debt, and goes bankrupt only to go out and attempt to acquire new debt immediately or soon after discharge, that is odd behavior. However, the way the financial community views the consumer market is extremely negative, and that does bring about desperation caused by hopelessness in the consumer community.
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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bridgyw34
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Posted: 21/September/2008 at 6:14am |
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I tried to apply for debt reduction...but because all my loans were in collections, I could no longer apply for interest relief, therefore not eligible for debt reduction. Does anyone know if there are any ways of getting debt reduction once your loans are in collections? Johhny any info? My main concern is that I don't necessarily want to dump my debt, but want to be able to make it manageable once the proposal is done in 2010. From what I am reading on here, it sounds like I will have creditors hounding me at that time unless there is a discharge of my debt and that the creditors don't work out any manageable deals with repayment. I guess I am trying to make a plan of action before the proposal is done.
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 21/September/2008 at 8:49am |
DDR - no.
You should ask your bankruptcy trustee to help you out here. Afteral, you are paying them thousands of dollars as it is. Unfortunately, I cannot do it for free. It will take time to really strategize and address the loans properly.
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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Angela
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Posted: 22/September/2008 at 8:57am |
If you were in University/College and got a student loan BEFORE 2000, you still may be eligible for interest relief and debt reduction. You will need to call the student loans offices to find out.
Most of what you need to know can be found on the Canada Student Loans and Grants website. However... it isn't all applicable or as easy as it says it is...
If you got a student loan AFTER 2000 then you need to be in touch with the NSCLS... I think that is what it is... because it doesn't apply to me, I am totally unsure of the acronym.
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Dance In The Sunshine
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DBforgiveness
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Posted: 23/September/2008 at 4:56pm |
I think I've seen that info...However there are some restrictions ie from CanLearn
Your loan must not be in default. That means it must not be in collection with the Canada Revenue Agency or another collection agency. Borrowers who participated in bankruptcy-related events on or after May 11, 2004 are no longer restricted from receiving Debt Reduction in Repayment, as long as they meet all other eligibility criteria for Debt Reduction in Repayment.
Now my question to Johnny is does this mean that if I filed Bankruptcy that I would still be responsible for the CSL portion of my student loan?
It also says that you need to speak with the financial inst that has your loan if before 2000 for any type of forgiveness.
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 24/September/2008 at 2:07am |
You are always responsible for your debt. Can you be more clear on this, perhaps? In any event, make sure that your loan is current before you go bankrupt. If you remain current (meaning not in default), and the systerm defaults you while engaged in bankruptcy proceedings, make the argument and make it stick using the legislation. System failures do occur. Read through this site. It is loaded with descriptions of them.
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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DBforgiveness
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Posted: 25/September/2008 at 2:36am |
When I say responsible I understand that I should always have the intent to pay my bills.
My question to clarify things is
Is the CSL (Federal) portion in bankruptcy?
I also understand that there are 3 portions Provincial, Federal, Bank risk... to some OSAP loans
I am attempting to locate all 3 but it seems that They (my OSAP creditors) make it almost impossible to locate all 3.
Is this because they want to make it difficult for people who plan to file Bankruptcy? 
I want to weight my options if I dont have to go bankrupt then I would like to know all factors
Who has my loans, where they are, when they were sent to collections, What the amount owing is, How do I make payments?
My loan is from the late 90's so the site says that I have to deal with the bank regarding any reductions.
The other question is Do outstanding loans prior to 2000 still handled by the HRDC (Federal)?
if not
Are they being held with the banks and the banks only?
The government has changed its position so many time since 2000 it is hard to understand the How,Who, What, Where's?
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 25/September/2008 at 4:21am |
If the timelines described in section 178 have surpassed n respect of an application for discharge, you may apply. When you go bankrupt - all your debt is bankrupt, except that which is endorsed by another, perhaps. Creditors do reserve the right to oppose your discharge, as is usually the case with the Canada Student Loans Program.
When you go bankrupt, you are bankrupt. The only way you are going to fnd out if anything is discharged is to wait untl your discharge hearing and see who is opposing it.
"I also understand that there are 3 portions Provincial, Federal, Bank risk... to some OSAP loans"
If your student loan was disbursed before year 2000.
"I am attempting to locate all 3 but it seems that They (my OSAP creditors) make it almost impossible to locate all 3."
OSAP is only one of them. You have to go elsewhere to fnd the rest of them. Go to who you owe. OSAP is only responsible for debt owed under the Ontario Student assistance Program.
Creditors alike are becoming more aware and are better prepared to protect themselves from unnecessary losses.
Lastly, unless you speak their language and see through their lens, you will never be able to gain a complete understanding that financial system, and why it behaves the way it does. With our Group (CFWG), we see through that lens, and also the lens you see through, and all of the behaviors and attitudes associated with the consumer arena, and the financial community.
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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gracie
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Posted: 22/November/2008 at 6:05pm |
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Looking for a solution....100,000 dollars in the hole with student loans. What do you do? I just finished my studies in education....not making even close enough to make those kind of payments. So, is bankruptcy an option....Do I have to wait 7 years before I apply for bankruptcy? If so, what are others options for me?? Please respond...love to hear some comments.
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OrlosGirl
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Posted: 23/November/2008 at 11:20am |
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Yes, new legislation is that you must wait seven years after the year you are done full time studies.
My suggestion is that you make regular payments for as much as you are able to afford until the Statute runs out in 2015. Then you declare bankruptcy. That way the judge may be more likely to grant you a complete discharge.
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Trying to do everything He tells me. (John 2:5)
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paulaffleck
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Posted: 23/November/2008 at 3:19pm |
Don't declare bankruptcy. Look into the new Repayment Assistance Program, which is a new program. If possible, move to a smaller town to teach, with low rent. Don't spend anything you don't have to, for about 3 years. That should get you down to a manageable level of debt, but only with extreme sacrifice.
That might not be realistic depending on circumstances, but it is my two cents worth.
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