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collywobbles
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Topic: Letter to CIBC, comments please Posted: 28/November/2004 at 5:19pm |
Hi all,
I've already described by scenario in this thread, and after a little
Saturday afternoon procrastination I've drafted a letter to the CIBC
seeking redress. I'm posting a copy of the draft text (with
sensitive or identifying info *'ed out or otherwise altered) here to
solicit comments, suggestions, etc. on the tack I'm taking with it.
I've seen the name Douglas Emersom in other threads as the chap
responsible for CIBC's relationship with HRDC ... is he also the eyes
this letter regarding an Ontario loan needs to reach?
Appreciate your help with this!
Colly
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To Whom it May Concern
I am writing in regards to my Ontario Student Loan (Loan number
*******), held at your institution from December, 1997, until September
of this year. The loan was placed into claim under circumstances
such that recall of the loan is merited.
I work in the forestry sector and during this year my employment
required that I be in remote locations from early May through until
late August. In May of this year – during the period I was
working in the bush – unforeseen difficulties with the Royal Bank
account from which pre-authorized payments were being made to both the
aforementioned OSL as well as a Canada Student Loan (Loan number
*******) also held at your institution caused payments on both to be
returned as NSF. Unable to repair the situation from my
location, payments were also missed in June and July.
I returned to McTropolis City in the evening of August 29th and made
contact with the third party collection agency to which your staff had
assigned my file, Global Credit and Collections of Richmond Hill, on
the morning of the 30th. This is reflected in their records on my
file. On August 31st, I made arrangements with a representative
at Global Credit to return both loans to current status. It was
agreed that I should make payment for the interest accrued to both
accounts since May and he would submit both loans for a revision of
terms. I was verbally assured that this would restore my accounts
to good standing.
Payment was made on August 31st, in cash, at the CIBC branch at 123
Forlorn Ave in McTropolis City (Transit #00***), as is documented by
the photocopied receipts enclosed. Payment to both accounts was
made in the amounts specified by the representative at Global
Credit. Proof of payment was faxed from the branch to Global
Credit. Phone contact was again made with the representative at
Global Credit who assured me that the fax had been received, that he
was submitting the revision of terms and – again – that the loans would
both be returned to good standing.
Despite these facts, the OSL was returned to the Provincial Government
on September 1st. In striking contrast, approval was given to the
revision of terms on the CSL and it is in good standing today.
I accept responsibility for the circumstances which caused the loans to
fall into arrears. I took all measures required of me to rectify the
situation within the time alotted me to do so. I engaged in an
oral contract with your duly authorized representative to correct the
arrears and fulfilled my obligations under that agreement.
In respect of these considerations it is manifestly clear that the
default of my OSL should not have occurred. It is my sincere
belief that the failure on the part of CIBC to honour the arrangement
reached with Global Credit owes only to miscommunication, either
between the respective firms or internal to one of them. I
anticipate your co-operation in correcting this oversight and its
consequences. I request (1) that the loan be recalled, (2) that
it be returned to good standing, (3) that the balance reflect the
amount owing as of September 1st of this year and (4) the full
co-operation of the CIBC in correcting all negative reports applied to
credit file as a result of the default with the credit reporting
bureaus.
Your most humble and obedient servant,
Collywobbles, Esq.
(Okay, it's really just signed 'Sincerely, Real Name' )
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collywobbles
plural noun
colloq:
1. Pain or discomfort in the abdomen.
2. Nervousness; apprehensiveness.
Etymology: 19c: probably from colic + wobble.
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collywobbles
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 5:20pm |
When I say 'this thread', I mean this thread.
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collywobbles
plural noun
colloq:
1. Pain or discomfort in the abdomen.
2. Nervousness; apprehensiveness.
Etymology: 19c: probably from colic + wobble.
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Islander
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 5:46pm |
Looks good to me!
Anyone else?
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What? Me, worry?
Alfred E Newman
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 5:57pm |
The letter is to the point, and has the ultimate impacting element to it, yes indeed. Good letter.
YOu should also reuqest that the notes on your file, the collection detail, and the general history. YOu should have this as back up. Then, you can see how many "black lines" from a magic marker are visible so you can assess if or what they arer trying to cover up in any event. If you were to see more than a couple of "blacked out" lines, this would be a strong indication.
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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Islander
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 6:03pm |
Good point, Johnny. And requesting that documentation (to which you are entitled) also ensures that you get an answer. Without that request this letter could well find its way to the circular file. Demanding that documentation gives you the right and an excuse to follow up if you don't get some action within a reasonable time frame.
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What? Me, worry?
Alfred E Newman
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collywobbles
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 6:06pm |
Thanks to both of you gents for the quick feedback.
Johnny, I'm not sure I understand what information you're suggesting I
ask for, and I don't know how to approach that matter anyway. I
had asked a call center rep at the CIBC for a copy of the notes on my
file earlier in my investigation and was told that they don't provide
that sort of thing.
Thanks for the kind words. If nothing else, its nice to know that
my $40,000 education bought me the ability to write a letter.
Money well spent .
Colly
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collywobbles
plural noun
colloq:
1. Pain or discomfort in the abdomen.
2. Nervousness; apprehensiveness.
Etymology: 19c: probably from colic + wobble.
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Islander
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 6:23pm |
Just include a line asking for a copy of the entire collection file including collection notes and details as well as the general history. You're entitled to that. They'll censor anything they don't want you to see. That's what's interesting.
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What? Me, worry?
Alfred E Newman
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collywobbles
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 6:33pm |
Okay, so at the end of the last paragraph I'm adding this sentence:
Additionally, I request to be sent a copy of all notes on my file including collection details and the general history.
Good? I'm still not clear of what use this might be, but you two are the ones to trust on this, so cheers.
Colly
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collywobbles
plural noun
colloq:
1. Pain or discomfort in the abdomen.
2. Nervousness; apprehensiveness.
Etymology: 19c: probably from colic + wobble.
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 6:36pm |
Yes, even if they censor it, they still have to disclose what they are attempting to censor if it is perceived that any misconduct or "rule breaking" has occured. Then, you can have the privacy commissioner (or the registrar appointed to the act of freedom of information) orchestrate a full audit based on certain findings once there is reason to do so.
When a CSR, or representative of any firm holding personal or confidential data about you refuses to accept your request for disclosure, or informs you that it is not possible, they are breaking the rules persuant to the privacy act (P.I.P.A. and P.I.P.E.D.A.) and the freedom of information act.
Remember, it is a human right.
Financial institutions, collection agencies, government lending sectors alike will try their hardest to avoid releasing certain information, or will do their best to stall you. This is why most people simply give up because of the time issues.
Colly, Islander and I are telling you that you may want to request the " actual account history" so you can actually see errors, omissions, or even direct breech of directives IF it has occured. Your letter is certainly a weapon of both action and defense, however, with the complete account histroy, you now have "night vision", so to speak.
Islander, please elaborate onthis one. Youmay be able to explain this a little better.
Johnny
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 6:51pm |
Islander,
It would also be a good idea to include a copy of the section in the FOI Act that stipulates such requests for personal information must be addressed in writing, and issued to the party who holds such information, to be distributed within a certain period of time... yadda yadda. Would this be practical? I think so.
See FOI - Section 10 through to 22.
http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/DBLaws/Statutes/English/90f31_e. htm#BK31
Also, check out "right of access" for the privacy act (P.I.P.A. and P.I.P.E.D.A.)
http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/P-21/94799.html#rid-94847
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 6:59pm |
Colly,
Yes, throw in that last sentence. also attach the excerpts from each act I linked out to you and reference them in your last sentence by writing:
"Lastly, I am requesting that your organization release to me a detailed history of my loan data including all notes and conversations logged by any/all representatives, and a detailed report explaining the circumstances leading up to the assignment of my student loan to a third-party collection agency."
There is also a date that I want you to keep your eyes open for, and this is the date of subrogation (the date that the government paid the bank back per the guarantee). This will tell you if or not your account was "prematurely" written off based on what you have described in your original post.
Johnny
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 7:01pm |
Colly,
If you do this right... you succed. Remeber that.
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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Islander
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Posted: 28/November/2004 at 7:08pm |
Right, Johnny.
Colly, I'd use Johnny's suggested wording, but rather than quote the text of the Acts, I'd be inclined simply to make the sentence read like this: "Lastly, pursuant to quote Act numbers and paras here, I am requesting that your organisation etc.....
This will let them know that you are aware of your rights and the depth to which they censor you file will give you a sense of how badly they f**ked up. It will also tell you if you have a case for civil litigation.
The whole procedure will communicate that you are civil, polite and non-confrontational but at the same time you are not a pushover and will not spread your legs for them.
Keep us posted. These abuses would be far rarer if everyone took a similar approach.
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Alfred E Newman
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collywobbles
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Posted: 29/November/2004 at 6:43am |
'Night vision', eh? ... alrighty ...
Changes made per your suggestions. Looks like I went to bed a
half hour too early last night. Do you guys sleep? Jumpin'
Jeebus, Johnny, your last post was 1:00 in the blessed AM Atlantic time!
I've been running on the assumption that this is just the result of a
boob job somewhere between the CIBC and the CA. You are obviously
concerned that there might be some deeper malfeasance going on.
I'll make the request and we'll see what we can see ... or not see what
we can't see ... and go from there. I will certainly keep this
forum abreast and may well require further advice.
Fingers crossed that I get what I'm looking for out of this one
letter. But that might be to trade those emerald green optics for
rose coloured glasses.
Heapings of gratitude,
Colly
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collywobbles
plural noun
colloq:
1. Pain or discomfort in the abdomen.
2. Nervousness; apprehensiveness.
Etymology: 19c: probably from colic + wobble.
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SolveStudentDebt
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Posted: 29/November/2004 at 6:50am |
Sleep is a luxury sometimes, I am afraid. I get 5-6 hours average per night. That is all I need.
Yes, as for ascertaining the boob job of CIBC, keep us "abreast".
Johnny
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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collywobbles
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Posted: 29/November/2004 at 7:00am |
No pun was intended ... nice catch, though!
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collywobbles
plural noun
colloq:
1. Pain or discomfort in the abdomen.
2. Nervousness; apprehensiveness.
Etymology: 19c: probably from colic + wobble.
|
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SolveStudentDebt
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Location: Canada
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Posted: 29/November/2004 at 7:26am |
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Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting. solvestudentdebt.com
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collywobbles
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Posted: 29/November/2004 at 9:54am |
Well, the letter is off via registered mail. On my way back from
the post office, I was thinking of your remarks, Johnny, about the date
of subrogation and decided to call OSAP to see if I could glean this
info from them.
Unfortunately, I think the woman who answered my call is a bit of a
dolt, and didn't really seem to know what I was talking about when I
asked when the province paid the CIBC for the loan (I don't know how I
could have made the request any clearer, but using the word
'subrogation' didn't help). All she was able to tell me was that
their file showed that default was effective September 14th and she believes that payment must have been issued to the CIBC on or after that date.
You guys are beginning to make a conspiracy theorist out of me.
But how do I use this info? Should I just wait and see if the
CIBC is willing to correct the situation first, and then move with this
if need be?
BTW, Islander, thanks for refilling my 'righteous indignation tank', it was beginning to run a little low.
Colly
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collywobbles
plural noun
colloq:
1. Pain or discomfort in the abdomen.
2. Nervousness; apprehensiveness.
Etymology: 19c: probably from colic + wobble.
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