This website is a testimony to the problems Canadian Student Loan borrowers experienced from approximately 1996 to 2008 and until their loans were paid off.
The privatization of the Student Loans system by the Chretien and Martin Liberal governments broke the system and defaulted thousands of borrowers who were trying to pay their loans. There were even stories of suicide due to the harassment of borrowers.
Read the report that I prepared back in 2007 here. Canada Student Loans-The Need for Change Fortunately the new Conservative government at the time revamped the program and fixed the system for new borrowers, but borrowers under the previous program were left with ruined credit and continued harassment from debt collectors.
I call on the Canadian Government to apologize to the borrowers affected by this fiasco and make amends.
Unfortunately the Liberal government is again clobbering the Education system with their upcoming changes to International Student Visas. Yes, there's a problem, but instead of a well thought out plan, they have pulled the emergency brake on the train causing a derailment. This has introduced unprecedented instability for both private and public education institutions who serve both international and local students.
Universities can't plan. I've heard of courses being cut because the government has no process in place for universities to send the newly required acceptance letters to the government.
This means that students who have been accepted can not attend courses that start in the summer 2024 semester. With cut sections, current Canadian students will have trouble getting courses, and may have to switch to part-time which changes their enrollment status and might trigger repayment of their loans or ineligibility for funding. I've seen this before. It wreaks havoc on the student loan borrowers.
Again, the Liberal government has messed up the education environment. Will the new system needed in a rush for the acceptance letters be the new Arrivecan scandal?
I call on the government to implement a slower phased in approach and delay the requirement of the acceptance letters until a process is in place to submit these letters.
QuoteReplyTopic: Canada student loan settlements Posted: 28/September/2003 at 9:00am
The Canada studet loans program avoids people offering compromise settlements like the plague. The Agency collectors are just as evasive. If any Canada student loan debtor wishes to make a compromise offer, there MUST be merit in the request. Also, every bit of documentation to support such an offer will be required also. It is possible to settle a Canada student loan if the circumstances warrant it. Unfortuantely, if you owe a CCRA tax debt, the only way they settle is through consumer proposals legislated by the insolvency act. This is not productive because if you owe CCRA, and have an interest in keeping your credit and financial requirements in order, a consumer proposal will destroy that level of personal security. especiually if you are a home owner holding a good level of equity. It is a TERRIBLE system. The tax collectors will tell you that they don't compromise.. but if you go bankrupt... then it might happen. The bankruptcy trustess make fortunes on people who owe tax debt.
But hey, bankruptcy doesn't apply to Student loan debt.
If you feel that you would like to offer qa compromise settlement for your Canada student loan, it is VERY difficult. Here are some of the areas where one may be considered:
1)Permanent disability resulting in the loss of limb(s), or state. (Mental illness rendering one unable to hold employement)
2)Extreme financial hardship
... but proving these matters to the governement is impossible because they make it that way. There are ways to penetrate their walls of objection. PERSERVERANCE.
I have seen several settlements over the years as a result of perserverance - and hard work.
Help_is_here -- MANY thanks for sharing the fruits of your experience, research, and expertise. I have a question concerning settlements:
Will provinces (I live in Ontario) accept proposals? I was contacted by Nova Collections in January about a 21,000 Ontario Loan (grown to 26K with interest) and soon created and sent a detailed proposal (bi-weekly payments for 4 years totalling 20,000 on the nose).
At first, Nova failed to even acknowledge the existance of my proposal, but eventually I was told by the "director of Central Operations," in writing, that "I can neither accept or reject your proposal until receiving your completed Financial Statement Form," a document bearing the official markings of the magament Board Secretariat of Ontario
I refused to provide this sensitive information to a Collection Agency and instead wrote directly to the Management Board Secretariat of Ontario -- specifically, the Chair, the now-defeated (wee!) David Tsubouchi. I said I would provide personal information ONLY to my government and NECER to a third party.
I received a letter from a supervisor with the Ontario management Board Secretariat telling me to provide my personal information the collection agency AT ONCE.
I complied and once again sent my poposal to the collectors.
Now, six months have passed during which I have faithfully sent money orders by registered mail to the collection agency every two weeks (as per the terms of my proposal) with a copy of the proposal. Nova Collections has stopped writing and calling, but they've not responded to my proposal.
So my question is simple: can an Ontario student loan be negotiated?
The OSL can be negotiated with. Unfortunately, it is left int he4 hands of the collection agency because the OSL does not want to do any of this tedious work. The agency will receive all of the criteria from the debtor... then the agency will forward it to the student loan body.
In many cases, it is just left to sit ... and rot. No one in that area wants to cut anyone a deal unless it is ABSOLUTELY neccessary. Perserverance makes it a priority if the issues are pushed so much as to make them work harder than they already are. IF a proposal holds merit, then it must be looked at by the student loan body.
To get a compromise offer approved, ALL of their required criteria must be met. This is discouraging to the debtor because there are so many requirements that most simply GIVE UP during the process. Most are unable to cope with the SUSPENSE and PRESSURES. The waiting game is usually a stick that breaks the camel's back for many.
So, I say this. If you are looking at filing a proposal that holds merit, it is possible. Ifr you would like private assistance doing this, you wopuld have to communicate with me by phone. Only so much can be discussed on line. Your privacy and confidentiality is protected - always.
Nice to finally find a site that deals with the reality of student loan debts. I have been trying to negotiate a lump sum payment to both NCO and the collections branch of the federal student loan department. I stopped paying my loan several years ago after not recieving the loan remission app several times and then being referred to the a collection agency after they lost my application. The CIBC national student center was the most disorganized institution I had ever been in contact with. My rational (shrouded in anger) was if my credit is screwed because of there mistake scew em there getting nothing!
Anyway, I m sure my loan is stats barred by now and I just want to start rebuilding my credit. I havent heard back from either agency and yes the waiting game is really making me impatient. I have a feeling my CSL is back with NCO because I attempted to make a offer to settle. I personally think they are refusing to get back to me to see how desperate I am. I thought of hiring a lawyer to make the settlement since they might have more luck. Any suggestions on how I can get the ball rolling?
Based on what you have stated, your loans wouldn't be stats barred. The CSLP will prevent you from becoming stats barred. Unfortunately, you will have little - to no success trying to offer a settment for your CSL. In your case, as you have described, it would be even more difficult because you ceased all acknowledgment. The HRDC offers little - to no compromise at all in most cases. Youc an hire a lawyer to make a proposal but you would be wasting your money.
There are certain ways to approach the government but, unfortunately, it would take a lot of my time to explain it all out. Many people feel the same as you in relation to anger and resentment for the mistreatment received by the administration. The agency is not getting back to you because there are no provisions to settle Crown debt and it is a waste of their time. If they come back to you and sau that they will settle, make sure you get a letter from the agency detailing the transaction because some have been known to offer false settlement offerings without the permission of their client(s). Sometimes, collectors will say, "pay this much", and eventually the loan will be stats barred and it will "wash away". This is totally untrue and an illegal practice.
The bottom line ... If your proposal to the Crown holds merit by: a) substantiation of financial hardship c) permanent disability d) Substantiation of inability to repay over the long-term e) proven errors and mis-calculation of the debt; then you would have a chance at a favorable compromise. If the Crown substantiates that you are able to pay based on their findings, any offer that you propose to pay less than what is owed will be rejected.
Just think of it this way ...
The government does everything they can to protect trheir accounts from becoming stats barred or compromised in any way. If they hand out settlements to people, then it would be putting them at risk of losing a heck of a lot of money. Ultimately, they deter people from asking for compromise given their requirements.
Johnny
Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting.
It is not IMPOSSIBLE to settle a Crown debt but it is very difficult. I have seen some passed through and they held tons of merit - for instance, a person who is permanently disabled and unable to work, a single parent on limited income with several children, terminally ill, etc. These hold merit based on thewir catastrophic circumstances both financially and emotionally.
Johnny
Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting.
The government does everything they can to protect trheir accounts from becoming stats barred or compromised in any way.
Hi there, Johnny:
HRDC seems to be such a disorganized mess of an organization...Do they really have people who monitor the status of accounts that are due to become stats barred? Do you know of any method that HRDC uses to keep track of defaulted accounts that are with collection agencies?
Hi, Thx for your speedy reply. I have furthered the cause and emailed that exec from CIBC regarding changes to reporting etc etc. This is the only place I know of where victims of lending malpractice can band together to get their stories heard to the people that need to hear them. Good work!
Since my loan is dating back to 1992 would it not have reached the statute of limitations?Also Is there any point in negotiating with NCO and if not can I take it up with Hrdc directly?
Anyone got any success stories on this subject.........thx for all your advice!
Yes, there are personel who cover these matters.. as well as a tracking system that monitors accounts that are due to become stats barred ... and yes I do know the methods used to track these matters.
Michaelo,
The statuts barred legislation kicks in once the loan has been defaulted. Case law allows the government to set the stats barred clock from either a) the time of default b) when they reimburse the bank per their guarantee c) from the date of last acknowledgment.
Just because your loan is dated back to 1992, it doesn't necessarily mean that it is stats barred. Choose a,b, or c. The feds could have paid the bank per their guarantee in, let's say, 1999. People who are riding their hopes on the stats barred legislation are going to find themselves at an even further loss. The government is taking measures to secure their best interest. That means no one will be slipping through the cracks of the S/B legislation. They will enforce their justice on anyone who is non-compliant at such time when there is a limitations issue up and coming. If they can't get you to voluntarily acknowledge the debt.. they will force you to.
Johnny
Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting.
Johnny, what is the easiest way to find out if my loans are stats barred? I have not made a payment on them since 1997.
After reading one of your entries regard ing public records in the credit report, I found that a judgement was made by "her majesty the queen" I asume this is CSL. I did not attend a court hearing for this and wonder what I can do about it. I read somewhere on this site that this judgement could be discredited by a lawyer. HAve you heard anything about this?
You can contact the HRDC to ask when the loan is to become stats barred - Verbally. This does not constitute acknowledgement. Basically, you would have to know when the loan was defaulted, when the government reimbursed the bank for the guartanteed portion. Usually, the date that the government repays the bank per the guarantee would be the date when the clock starts ticking. The governemnt is tricky. They can use the two dates as a limitation period. Either the date the loan was paid back to the bank, or the actual borrower's default date.
The judgment registered by "Her Majesty the Queen" is in fact a Crown debt judgment. Once the judgment is there, you are stuck with it. You can try to oppose but that would cost you a ton of money in legal expenses.. and wouldn;t earn you any benefit really. The government is convinced you owe the money, and have not complied with the mandates set out.. so they referred you for justice and acquired judgement. This is their process to keep borrowers from qualifying under the stats barred legislation.
I have never heard of a judgment being discredited or reversed by the crown unless there were balance errors int he proof of claim. I suppose if you have a good enough lawyer, anything is possible.. but that also depends on how much money one has to throw away on an unsure bet.
Johnny
Solve Student Debt specializes in solutions for students and graduates in student loan default, and those at risk of defaulting.
Thought this letter I sent to our new PM would fit in this section. I've made this proposal before and don't hold out much hope for it ever being implemented.
Dear Mr. Martin:
First, let me congratulate you on becoming Canada’s twenty-first prime minister. I’m writing to you today to propose a change to the Canada Student Loan Act. I believe that the best rules or regulations are those that are simple and my proposal is simplicity itself: That the amount of interest payable on a Canada Student Loan will never exceed the amount borrowed.
So, if a student leaves university with $25,000 in loans owing, he or she will never pay more than $25,000 in interest, or $50,000 in total. Now, most students who are able to follow the payment schedule will never come close to paying that much interest, and this small amendment to the act will not apply to them.
However, for those of us who have had difficulty making payments, particularly in the years immediately following graduation, this small, simple change could be a lifesaver, a reason for hope, and possibly result in fewer defaults and declarations of bankruptcy.
In my own case, my loan principal was $7,650. During the late 1980s, when my loan was to be repaid, I was under- or un-employed. I spent one winter on a U.I. claim of $400 per month. So the interest, at 11.5%, grew and grew, until the 1990s when repayment began, but of course the payments went to pay off the interest that had accrued. I have now paid over $11,000 and I haven’t paid a penny of my original principal. In fact there is still almost $2,500 in interest owing, in addition to the untouched principal. If I was able to do so, and I paid off my loan today, the total repayment would exceed $21,000. Given my present ability to repay, it will take me ten more years to do so, and the total cost will have increased to over $25,000.
The lesson seems to be that if I had a lick of common sense, I would have declared bankruptcy in the late 1980s and saved myself tens of thousands of dollars. Or I could have been one of the lucky ones who are never pursued by the CSL department, and therefore have neither a debt or repay or a bankruptcy to stain their credit rating. And yes, these people exist, they have jobs, they pay taxes, they just don’t pay their student loans. I have met them.
My question for the Government of Canada, for my Prime Minister, is, why do you have a debt collection policy that favours large corporations and discriminates against individual Canadians, why do you tolerate waste on a massive scale but hound ordinary citizens for every last dime they owe? If cucumbers won’t grow in Newfoundland or Bricklins won’t fly in New Brunswick, the millions of dollars spent are written off. If Mr. Radwanski is in financial difficulty weeks before he’s offered a well-paid government job, the large amount of money he owes the government is written off. If the government pays $500,000 for a report that’s never received, it’s written off.
But if an individual Canadian borrows money through the Canada Student Loan program, ostensibly a social program, he is charged the going interest rate, and that rate will not change no matter how much the prime rate might fluctuate. (This may or may not be the case today but it certainly was for me and thousands of others.) So if his loan comes due when interest rates are high, say 11.5%, and he doesn’t have a lot of success finding regular work, then the interest quickly accumulates, the molehill becomes a mountain of debt, and not a penny of it will ever, ever be written off.
My proposal would change this. It would mean that the government of Canada would actually be writing off some small amounts of money owed it by ordinary Canadians. But we Canadians affected would still be on the hook for the original principal and an equal amount of interest. Remember, too, that this will only apply to those who have not been successful enough to make regular payments; all others will pay off their loans and pay far less interest. In my own case, this policy would mean that the maximum amount I would pay would be $15,300 on my original principal of $7,650. That means I would at this moment owe approximately $4,000 instead of $10,000. What’s really interesting is that if I were then able to pay this $4,000 off in the next year, the government’s net return on my indebtedness would still be over 5%! Hardly a drag on government finances.
I’m treading water and I have been for years. I’m tired and I wonder why it is so important to the Government of Canada that they collect all that interest calculated at 11.5% on my student loan. My proposal would make life for myself, and others in a similar situation, much easier without causing harm to the government. I can’t imagine the majority of Canadians being anything but supportive. I understand you want to do things differently during your time in office, that you want to make Canada a better place. This would be one small, but important, step in that direction.
I there were a petition on dealing with student loans and getting the government to focus on those of us struggling to make our payments, if such a petition were coming around I'd sign it for sure. B. Brown your letter to Mr. Martin is certainly a good start I hope you sent it!
For those of you wondering who "THE O's" are, well we are a family of 6 (six) Mom Dad, and 4 (four) children. Dad never finished college because of SL being sent to collections. Took out a personal loan with a co-signor to pay it back plus other debts incurred because of college such as (VISA, & Department Store CC given in my first week of college). Couldn't get a car when when married because of bad credit original co-signor signed again refinanced personal loan, which became a car loan as well. Mom gets a cash settlement another source pays off Dad's loan in full 5 years before maturity. (total loan was 17K).
Now mom is in the hot seat with Allied International for the full amount of her student loans (she has 3 seperate loans). We've applied for interest relief 7 times and been given the royal run around by Royal Bank and the National Student loan center. Neither of them can seem to agree on who we should be dealing with. Even Allied is getting the runnaround from the Bank and NSLC. As a result intrest relief has never been approved and we honestly can't make the minimum monthly payments, let alone the full amount now due for each loan.
Dad O has been reading in these forum pages about a statue of limitations through Equifax Like 6 years and 5 years YEAH it's there as plain as day. It was getting better for Dad O as of 03 & 04/1998. Not sure which of these two limitations Dad O falls under (hope it isn't the 6 year rule) Either way Dad O would like to help Mom O out by Cosigning a personal loan to refinance the Debt she has but we both have bad credit. Mom works full time (60 hours/week) & attends University for one course a semester which she pays out of her own pocket up front, because she can't get OSAP, she has one year left in a 4 year BA Psychology course, but can't fast track to the finish because of serious mis management and thumb sitting by her lending institution and those that are supposed to see to it that we all make our payments on the government secured loans.
I know that most of what I have written seems like a garbled mess of rants and personal information, but I had to get this off OUR chest's.
Also if you have answers or similar stories about IR applications or dealing with AIC (Allied International) let us know.
OH yeah and Jonny if you read this and I hope you do, you seem to be most helpful to all within the forum pages, Can we request to speak with only one individual at a collection agency or bank with regards to repayments terms, rather than speaking with several hundred people and having to repeat our selves several hundred times? We did speak with one lady and mentioned that we only wished to speak with her and she said that if anyone else from AIC called to tell them we would like to speak with only her. We assume then that we can request to speak with one person ONLY. Of course when we make these intentions known to the caller they get rather upset and raise their voice and even hang up.
Is anyone familiar with the terms, "long-term kit" and having a debt go "out of option"? I spoke generally with someone from the Canada Student Loans Enquiry Office, and she told me a bit about it.
Basically, you fill out some forms called a "long-term kit", and if you are approved, they might put your loan "out of option". As i understood it from her, this means that interest stops accruing, and they stop asking you for payments, and they don't take your tax refunds. So from what she said to me, it sounds like the debt goes into a "dead zone", where its "on your record" but doesn't affect you in any way. But a person has to appear totally unable to pay back the debt, in this case, i think.
Now i asked her more about it, but she said some stuff that was nonsensical, so perhaps she didn't totally understand it. She said a person could "choose" to repay the debt one day, but didn't have to!
Does anyone know about this? What if the person starts making lots of money in the future? Does it reawaken? Does anyone know anything about this?
I was told about a "hardsh*t kit" that one could fill out all the applications and apply and there was the possibility that you could be approved.
I called and asked them to send me one, and this was in 2001, so needless to say I am still waiting for it, and I have called several times to get one.
Hi Hunter, i am curious. Are you making payments on your loan, or is yours like mine, where no payments are being made? I am sure you explained your situation in other posts, could you give me a link to those posts?
So it looks like you are saying they are just ignoring you? I could be in for a rude awakening. From what they girl told me, you ask for the "long-term kit" and they send it out to you.
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Johnny wrote:
